i love math

[Dalya]

still besties. too lazy to argue.

someone find me a really good concert to go to and then i'll quit bitching at everyone.

[roach]

still besties. too lazy to argue.

someone find me a really good concert to go to and then i'll quit bitching at everyone.

this will be good I hear. don't know about the artists, but yells it eels is pretty fantastic if you're into jazz, not really sure what kind it is, but it's the kind I like. seems SUBkomander is a noise kind of stuff... knobs sent through knobs twisted with effects and junk. it was interesting, but yells at eels is good.

Saturday, the 31st
8-11 p.m.

"Existence is Elsewhere"
A Benefit fo Art-alot-athon

featuring music by:
Yells At Eels
SUBKommander

and visual art by:
Jason Barnett
Janelle Tohill
Alison Welsh
KUNST
Larry Carey
Nick Bradford
Leta Kish
Loren V. Era

Avenue Arts
823 Exposition Ave.
Donations suggested/accepted/appreciated

http://www.myspace.com/yellsateels

there are no lyrics, so that knocks out one possible knock

[eebs]

or you could fly over for one of theseshows

[Dogatron]

I looked through it too and thought it was bigger last time.

the douche bags with hot chicks was better, they had all those orange new jersey people.

most of us have done some pretty dumb fashion things as youngsters... I'm really glad I can say i've never gone orange.

this made me laugh

http://digg.com/comedy/Digitally_Enhanc ... People_PIC

[squeezle]

to me, those bands are the equivalent of a job. the way they perform, it's like it's just a fun job to them. they don't even seem to love music, at least not their own. they just perform and maybe dance and smile a little but there is no passion. and that is like the exact opposite of what music should be, at least to me. what is the point of passionless art? and if they are of the opinion that their music isn't art, then why are they spending their life doing something they're not truly passionate about?

i don't want to go around beating horses, but i just read through this thread

dalya, did you ever think some people/bands express passion and intensity in a way that you don't recognize, and the fact that you don't see it says as much about you as it does about them? why does passion have to look a certain way? there's a lot of music and art out there that people pour their hearts into that completely bores me (like the spree - snoozefest), but it doesn't make their passion any less real - it's just a kind of passion that i don't get. just a thought.

[Dalya]

I'd agree with you if I was just judging based on the sound, but I think you can tell by watching someone if they are feeling passionate or not. I'm not saying it has to be a specific emotion, but something needs to be passionately felt, even if it sadness or whatever. Or even if it is like... passionate relaxation. Beulah comes to mind. Beulah is "chill" (that word makes me cringe) but it still sounds passionate and they WERE passionate when I saw them live. Their music is not exactly heavy, so they could have easily stood there and played like hippie dudes, but they were into it and it was infectious.

At this point, I'm not even talking about I love math because, fine, it could have been an off night or whatever and I won't judge them eternally for one semi-show. But just in theory, I'm not interested in going to a show and watching people stand on stage and just play. There is needs to be that extra something, which is the reason you fall in love with a song or a band. Yes of course, bands can do whatever they want and if they're making a living doing something i think is bullshit, then obviously a lot of people disagree with me.

But I would assume that the reason people make music is because they have felt what i feel for music, at least at some point. I don't know how you could go to an incredible concert when you're a teenager or whatever, and then start your own band and not want to create the same feeling in your audience. Being in a band is about performing. If all you cared about was the song, you would be a singer/songwriter. If you WANT to be the one up there performing it, then perform! I'm sick of all these bands (now talking about MTV, etc.) who's priority is looking cool and copying everyone that came before. What's the point? Doesn't it get boring?

Ramble...

[aquaphase]

I'd agree with you if I was just judging based on the sound, but I think you can tell by watching someone if they are feeling passionate or not. I'm not saying it has to be a specific emotion, but something needs to be passionately felt, even if it sadness or whatever. Or even if it is like... passionate relaxation. Beulah comes to mind. Beulah is "chill" (that word makes me cringe) but it still sounds passionate and they WERE passionate when I saw them live. Their music is not exactly heavy, so they could have easily stood there and played like hippie dudes, but they were into it and it was infectious.

At this point, I'm not even talking about I love math because, fine, it could have been an off night or whatever and I won't judge them eternally for one semi-show. But just in theory, I'm not interested in going to a show and watching people stand on stage and just play. There is needs to be that extra something, which is the reason you fall in love with a song or a band. Yes of course, bands can do whatever they want and if they're making a living doing something i think is bullshit, then obviously a lot of people disagree with me.

But I would assume that the reason people make music is because they have felt what i feel for music, at least at some point. I don't know how you could go to an incredible concert when you're a teenager or whatever, and then start your own band and not want to create the same feeling in your audience. Being in a band is about performing. If all you cared about was the song, you would be a singer/songwriter. If you WANT to be the one up there performing it, then perform! I'm sick of all these bands (now talking about MTV, etc.) who's priority is looking cool and copying everyone that came before. What's the point? Doesn't it get boring?

Ramble...

I'd prepare to be horribly disappointed by life.

[squeezle]

I'd agree with you if I was just judging based on the sound, but I think you can tell by watching someone if they are feeling passionate or not.

i wasn't just talking about sound - i'm saying that passion doesn't have to look a certain way and people won't always display passion in a way that you can identify. [/anthropological explanation deleted] it's fine that you don't like band, but don't insunuate that they lack passion because they can't stir your emo soul.

[Dalya]

It's not about looking at the band and "seeing" anything, its about sensing something. You can innately feel other people's energy, positive or negative, or lack thereof. That's where you get your instincts. I don't instinctively trust someone because they have an attractive face, as Disney movies suggest I should. It is an unspoken thing that goes beyond the senses or reasoning.

Plenty of people are passionate about things that I could care less about, but I recognize their passion. Business majors, for example. Art historians. I hate Bjork's music but I sense her passion. I'm not saying the music has to speak to ME personally or the band has to look or act or sound like anything. But they should convey SOMETHING to someone. You can't feign passion... When you watched the spree, Shauna, could you not sense their passion for what they were doing (in the very beginning, not later years), even if you yourself weren't passionate about it?

It is the same thing in all areas... What determines a good or bad professor? A professor that lacks passion is boring, even in a subject you love. And a passionate professor (even if it is a quiet passion) can make you enjoy a subject you hated. This is what happened to me in calculus. My professor wasn't shrieking about the joy of math and using colorful powerpoints to keep our interest. He wasn't even a positive, smiley kind of guy; he was really sarcastic and softspoken. He just nonverbally conveyed that he enjoyed what he was doing. When a person conveys their passion, they are giving proof of the subject's worth. It forces you to wonder what induced that passion. A lack of passion has the opposite effect, implying the subject doesn't warrant passion. If a band is performing a song in a way that implies they don't give a shit, why would I?

Like I said, I know there will be plenty of bands that I don't like. I don't expect to like everything, even if I recognize the valid reasons why I *should*. Take Bjork, I see her passion but I don't relate to it, at least not yet. But I differentiate between a band/artist that I "can't get into" (implying I understand why I should/could get into it) and a band that I see as passionless (usually referred to as "crap").

It is disheartening to go a long time without seeing music really move anybody, not just me. I see people (including myself) settling for what's "good" i.e. whatever is the most pleasant (like the prettiest Denny's waitress). *prepares for a slew of rebuttals* In the absence of something great I'm left to sit and think about why these other things are less than great. I don't expect every band to perform a show full of songs that change my existence as I know it, but I do expect more than just easy listening. I expect some small change in someone. Watching I Love Math was like watching a bunch of inert gases float around. What's the point of being in a room full of people if you're not reacting to/with them?

I'd rather read your anthropological explanation because I don't understand what you mean by passion that I can't recognize.

[roach]

from what i've heard since the i love math show is you really didn't see i love math, it was the singer and the drummer but having rhett and dylan play also kind of turned it into a bunch of friends fucking around for another friend's going away party... something i'm really kicking my-wimp-ass-for-hitting-the-wall-self for missing.

ro"not trying to defend it, just pissed I missed it"ach

[Dalya]

As a final point, I'll say this for me personally and not as a generalization, even though I feel it's a general fact:

When I am passionate, my guard is down. When I am truly excited about something - a concert, a workout, a book- I have total confidence and am swept up in my own excitement. I also feel that everyone around me should be excited about what I am excited about, and I therefore convey that to them. When I am at an amazing concert, I will dance with strangers and carry on conversations as if we're old friends (I'm sure everyone on here has felt that natural high at a concert where you are suddenly really social). When I'm in a class I love, I will call out answers to all the questions without censoring myself so as not to look nerdy, and after class I will talk to the people around me, expecting them to be equally passionate. Right now, I am passionate about what I'm saying so I don't really give a shit how long my responses are.

Passion is also about vulnerability, because you are opening yourself up to the fact that someone can mock or destroy what you're passionate about. The ultimate example would be sex - you are at your most vulnerable (physically and emotionally) during sex. You can't have passionate sex whilst sucking in your stomach for fear that your partner will think you're fat. All of that has to go away to really experience passion. Fear has no place where passion is concerned.

Maybe it all comes down to the fight or flight thing. If you're fighting, you're passionate about living. If you're fleeing, you're just trying not to die. That's pure fear as a motivation, whereas fighting has passion as a motivation. Maybe the passionless bands are only making music so they don't have to do something else (fleeing from a corporate job).

In any case, I don't want to be someone who just tries not to die. I want to enjoy my life and contribute to other's enjoyment and also reduce their suffering as much as possible. That's where things like preventive medicine come in , which contribute to actual enjoyment of life versus just treating the ailment thereby preventing suffering (not necessarily granting health). And I want to be surrounded by people who are of a similar mindset. For me, the ultimate goal is to enjoy life. The only way to do that is to help others enjoy their lives, which is kind of like a chicken/egg scenario, but no less true. Humans are social animals and can barely survive without some connection to the larger group.

That's where music comes in. Music is a nonverbal (or semi-verbal) way to unite the group. It has physical effects on the body as well as psychological effects. Even listening to a song by yourself is social, because you're connecting, even remotely, to some human at some time (even if they are dead). It's still not isolation. A concert is like the ideal social union, short of an orgy. There are few places where otherwise dissimilar members of the group can unite and share a common passionate experience that is based almost entirely on the senses (i.e. not a political rally).

I'm sorry but that is the POINT of a concert, and I won't back down from that idea. If that's not the point, then what is? Why spend your money to see them in person if it doesn't have an interactive quality?

Anyway I'm clearly rambling and can't remember my initial argument anymore, so I'll just wait till someone yells at me and then clarify what I meant. I'm hungry.

[Dalya]

a bunch of friends fucking around for another friend's going away party... something i'm really kicking my-wimp-ass-for-hitting-the-wall-self for missing.

basically, that's why I said I'm not really talking about them anymore, just bad shows in general.

[squeezle]

i'm just saying that emotions (like passions) are socially shaped - so the emotions we experience and the emotions we recognize in others are dependent on how we learn these concepts. and not everyone learns the same thing - there are six only agreed-upon universal emotions (fear, anger, sadness, happiness, suprise, and disgust) and everything else is contingent on biological, familial, cultural, social, etc factors.

and no, i never got the spree's 'passion' - it always seemed contrived and cliché to me.... too much of an act

[Dalya]

exactly those are the 6 emotions you can feel passionately... they're the core of all emotions and recognizable to everyone. and i'm not talking about identifying which emotion it is, i'm talking about recognizing that there is AN emotion.

[squeezle]

never mind